Sunday, February 8, 2009

Dawkins moving toward deism?

From Melanie Phillips at ToTheSource (hat tip: Veritas Rex)...

On October 21st I attended the debate between Richard Dawkins and John Lennox at Oxford's Natural History Museum. This was the second public encounter between the two men, but it turned out to be very different from the first. Lennox is the Oxford mathematics professor whose book, God's Undertaker: Has Science Buried God? is to my mind an excoriating demolition of Dawkins's overreach from biology into religion as expressed in his book The God Delusion -- all the more devastating because Lennox attacks him on the basis of science itself.

In the first debate, which can be seen on video on this website, Dawkins was badly caught off-balance by Lennox's argument precisely because, possibly for the first time, he was being challenged on his own chosen scientific ground.

This week's debate, however, was different because from the off Dawkins moved it onto safer territory– and at the very beginning made a most startling admission. He said: A serious case could be made for a deistic God....True, he was not saying he was now a deist; on the contrary, he still didn't believe in such a purposeful founding intelligence, and he was certainly still saying that belief in the personal God of the Bible was just like believing in fairies. Nevertheless, to acknowledge that 'a serious case could be made for a deistic god' is to undermine his previous categorical assertion...

Anthony Flew, the celebrated philosopher and former high priest of atheism, spectacularly changed his mind and concluded -- as set out in his book There Is A God -- that life had indeed been created by a governing and purposeful intelligence, a change of mind that occurred because he followed where the scientific evidence led him. The conversion of Flew, whose book contains a cutting critique of Dawkins's thinking, has been dismissed with unbridled scorn by Dawkins – who now says there is a serious case for the position that Flew now adopts!...

Dawkins told me that, rather than believing in God, he was more receptive to the theory that life on earth had indeed been created by a governing intelligence – but one which had resided on another planet. Leave aside the question of where that extra-terrestrial intelligence had itself come from, is it not remarkable that the arch-apostle of reason finds the concept of God more unlikely as an explanation of the universe than the existence and plenipotentiary power of extra-terrestrial little green men?...

The great question, however, is whether his own theory is now in the process of further evolution -- and whether it might even jump the species barrier into what is vulgarly known by lesser mortals as faith.

4 Comments:

At April 26, 2009 at 3:31 AM , Blogger Apostle of Reason said...

hmmm you really think that is what happened? You watched the interview whole and think Dawkins showed some sign that underneath he agreed in some way to the existence of a god as a reasonable proposition? Really?
You should include transcript supporting such assertions or admit openly at the beginning that the blog is baseless conjecture. Your follow-up blog, I trust, will answer the question posed in this blog with a firm 'No. Dawkins still firmly grounded in the wonder of actual reality.'

 
At April 26, 2009 at 9:18 AM , Blogger Eric Schansberg said...

Baseless conjecture? No. Eyewitness testimony that could be questioned? Yes. (Eyewitnesses who would testify otherwise are free to offer their observations here.)

I concur that it would be much better to have the video or transcript. Perhaps it's available on-line in the wide variety of materials from their debates. Let me know if you find anything.

The claims in the original post seem reasonable-- given Dawkins' seemingly avid pursuit of Truth and some of the odd things he said in Expelled.

No, I cannot say-- nor can you-- that "Dawkins [is] still firmly grounded in the wonder of actual reality."

 
At April 26, 2009 at 11:13 PM , Blogger Apostle of Reason said...

Here's Dawkins in slamming the article you 're-present' including playing the audio from the gathering the article it was based on:

http://richarddawkins.net/article,3752,Richard-Dawkins-at-American-Atheists-09,Richard-Dawkins

It includes the actual full audio of the section that the article in your blog is 'based on'. Have a listen and see what you make of it for yourself.

Dawkins even coins the phrase "Mining the Eddington Concession" to describe this type misleadingly selective or out of context 'reporting'.

So again, do you really think Dawkins is 'moving toward deism?'

 
At April 28, 2009 at 5:01 PM , Blogger Eric Schansberg said...

AR,

Thanks for the heads up on this-- and my apologies for unknowingly participating in this sham and on behalf of any Christians who have done likewise. Dawkins should be allowed the dignity of his views-- without being quoted out of context.

For those interested in checking out AR's point, check out minutes 16-26 for the post-debate audio of Lennox, Dawkins' comments in the debate, and finally the reference to Phillips' article getting this rolling.

All that said, none of this speaks to the odd things Dawkins said in Expelled-- his embrace of the possibility of intelligent design and the general incoherence of his views. Bizarrely, Dawkins also chooses to address his most interesting scene in Expelled in this video (minutes 27:45-32:30).

Finally, it's ironic that Dawkins does his own Carrington in eliminating the end of what Stein says in that interview (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlZtEjtlirc)-- and engages in his own revisionism by claiming that he didn't take Stein seriously at the end of the interview.

Bottom line: Dawkins is still an avid atheist-- and still adheres to his remarkable faith.

 

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